Ep146: Ricardo Vasquez

Today on the More Cheese, Less Whiskers podcast we're talking with Ricardo Vasquez from Toronto and Ricardo has something pretty neat. He's working on creating a system in a community and a membership program for people who want to pursue mixed martial arts.

We had a really great conversation. Ricardo’s been a lifetime MMA practitioner. He's been involved in the sport for a very long time and has a real passion for it. He's just getting started with it as a business, so we talked a lot about how to get things going.

How do you start with a big vision for something that could have a global community, but take actionable steps to really to get started. Where do you begin and how do you structure and organize it so that you've got a scalable business. What we call a scale ready algorithm.

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Transcript - More Cheese Less Whiskers 146


Dean: Ricardo Vasquez.

Ricardo: Hey, Dean. How's it going?

Dean: Good. That sounds like a prize winning MMA fighter name.

Ricardo: Yeah, I wish, man.

Dean: It sounds like the name of a champion. Welcome. Where are you calling from?

Ricardo: I'm in Toronto.

Dean: Hey, perfect. Is it warm enough for me yet?

Ricardo: No, man, you don't want to come here right now. Too cold.

Dean: Okay, I'm not going to be there till the first week in June. Hopefully we'll have plenty of time.

Ricardo: You should be okay for June. It's a little wet right now. It's 11 degrees Celsius.

Dean: That's not enough.

Ricardo: -too cold for me, man.

Dean: That's not enough. Where in Toronto are you?

Ricardo: Actually right at this very moment, I'm in Whitby, but I'm in like East Toronto, Scarborough. I know you're from Toronto, right? Originally?

Dean: Yeah, yeah, I am.

Ricardo: Yeah, that's right. I'm in the Scarborough East Toronto area.

Dean: Okay, perfect. Let's get right to it. We got the whole hour here, and seems like you got some cool stuff going on. I want to hear all about it.

Ricardo: Cool. Before we go on I just want to make sure you can hear me okay.

Dean: Yep.

Ricardo: I'm actually in the car, speaker, the car speaker thing here. Can you hear me hear me okay, it should be okay here?

Dean: Yes, it's great.

Ricardo: Okay, perfect. Let's do it.

Dean: Okay. Tell me the back story so far and then what we're going to focus on.

Ricardo: Right. Okay. Right now I have a site, it's mmawarriorcircle.com. Basically what it is, is an online MMA training through digital products. I've just recently been kind of changing some things up as far as what I'm hoping to offer, my ideal customers. How I tried to narrow it down is from wimp to fight ready. That's basically what I'm trying to put together, so taking them from defenseless to actually being able to defend themselves, and mixed martial arts, and all the components that go into it.

Now, there's a little bit which is, I'm a big fan of auxiliary learning and mnemonics and stuff. I'm really into the memory stuff, so I wanted to combine speed learning into it. In other words, how to utilize speed learning principles and methodologies and apply it to mixed martial arts, so that they can get from A to B as quickly as possible. It's not like a quick rick or short cuts, or anything like that, but just trying to accelerate the process, because a lot of people make a lot of mistakes, including myself, that they lose years when in months you could actually get much further if you followed these principles. That's kind of where I'm at and still very new. I'm still trying to find the language, and identify my target market, and all that cool stuff you talk about.

Dean: Are you live right now and working with people? Are you making sales or is this, you're getting ready to launch this?

Ricardo: I'm getting ready to relaunch it. I had launched it in the past. It was a completely different business model. It was almost more of a hobby, but now I'm ready to launch and get more serious. I've just started to put some stuff up, as far as lead magnets and things like that.

Dean: Gotcha.

Ricardo: Another thing I should mention is, I was just conflicted as far as the business model I wanted to use, because there's another site called bjjfanatics.com. What they've done is they basically partner with different high level instructors and martial artists, and they kind of work together and create courses. This isn't to Brazilian jujitsu, but it's something that I like the idea behind it, because I don't know everything, and there are a lot of experts outside of my area of expertise that's still within MMA, that I would like to have a joint venture with. That's where I wasn't sure as to go that route, or just to be the one providing the information.

Dean: Right. There's a different thing between somebody who's an MMA fan who would know these people, like you think about, you're talking about that there a celebrity or famous, but the thing about Mitch is, is that those people are famous because you're an MMA fan. They're not famous outside of that world. Just like when you look at it that people in the marketing world, I'm much more famous than in the real world. That people know marketing and know stuff that I might have some celebrity status, but in the real world in terms of a thousand people just in general, might not know who I am or who they are.

You want to kind of think that through in terms of who your target audience is. Like, if you're thinking about just people who are looking at this as something because they want to go from helpless, as you said, to able to defend themselves and confident in everyday living kind of social situations like that. That's one thing versus someone who is aspiring to be an MMA superstar. You know?

Ricardo: Right.

Dean: Which end of the scale are you thinking? It sounded like you were looking for people who are maybe new to MMA, that they're interested in this confidence, or being able to defend themselves, or confidence as opposed to people who are looking to become MMA fighters.

Ricardo: Yeah. I had actually narrowed down some different profiles or avatars to who I could potentially speak to. There's a handful of them. Like, the actual pro fighter, the aspiring fighter, the coach. There's coaches out there who have fighters under their belt, There's the weekend warrior, somebody who they're just doing it to stay in shape, but they also like the idea of being able to defend themselves. Then there's the raw beginner who’s probably a fan of the sport as well, and they probably don't want to fight professionally or anything like that, but they would like to be able to train and be at a level where they could definitely defend themselves if needed.

Where I'm at right now, I think I've narrowed it down to, more than likely either the weekend warrior or the person who's kind of just getting into it, so like a beginner, because I feel like I have much more to offer. Again, I haven't really tested and I'm not 100% sure. I know that that's a really important decision. Right?

Dean: It is. So much of it is a lot of times we talk about selecting a single target market as profit activator one. A lot of that goes with really getting clear on what you're during unit is going to be about. Profit activator five, what's the dream come true result that you're able to achieve for people. If you start with that, with the circle of things and skills, and insight, and knowledge, and capability that you have to actually get somebody an outcome, we could start with that and then look for the ideal person who that matches up with.

When you look at it, what's your position in the MMA world? Are you famous in that world? Are you a former or current champion fighter? Are you a recognized expert in the industry or are you a student of it, who's become a real fan, and realize you can teach people this? What's your position in that world?

Ricardo: My position in that world is, I'm an experienced martial artist myself, a little kid. I'm a full time martial artist. In other words, I train every single day. It's much more than just a hobby to me. I don't actively compete, however I do train with and help amateur and pro fighters prepare. I have a lot of knowledge within the actual combat itself and the other areas that are within it, like exercise science, and sports psychology, those things, but I wouldn't say I'm definitely not well known in it at all, but I do have a lot of knowledge.

I help a lot of beginners as well. I have friends who are like, hey man, I really want to learn because It's contagious and you see somebody that really likes it and often times carries over to them and they want to know more. Right?

Dean: Yeah.  There's the difference. When you look at it and there's no right or wrong about what your actual position is, it's just being aware of it. I have a client who has karate schools, but he's a five time world champion karate master. That's a position that is an expert. Five time world champion, I can show you how to do this, kind of thing. There's that level of credibility in it. Then there's a thing where if you are the head fan kind of thing, a student, that's a really good position too.

I think about my friend Will that owns fuzzyyellowballs.com. Fuzzyyellowballs.com is a tennis instruction website. There's probably an opportunity to model some of how that works. He partners with the experts to create courses that are part of his membership program. They've got the instructional, the core instructional stuff like ground strokes, and volleys, and serve, and all the core things of what you need to learn, but then they also have all of these. You learn doubles from the Bryan brothers, who are the best doubles team ever, or you can learn tennis from Patrick Rafter, former number one player in the world.

He partners with them. This was the great thing, he was doing it before master class. Have you seen those master class videos online?

Ricardo: I have, yeah.

Dean: Yeah. Essentially, same kind of thing. Taking this master at one element of whatever the elements are of what you do, and having a master class with that one person, going deep. I think that part of when you look at this, it's probably going to supplement their martial arts practice, because you're not going to one of those things like you can't teach a kid to ride a bike at a seminar. You can't teach somebody to fight online. That's really the same thing. You've got to actually get in and do it. You know?

Ricardo: That's right, yeah. They definitely need a place where they can train, in most cases. You know?

Dean: Yes. That then, since you're in this situation and you've got a general audience, I mean you're not talking about a super small niche market, I mean MMA is main stream and it's become popular, so everybody knows about it and it's become a popular training method, so it may be a great opportunity for you to create a hybrid program where there is a live component to it, that this, the online stuff is supplementing. You know?

Ricardo: Right.

Dean: Perhaps even look at that then as a licensing, or a syndication, or even a franchise type of situation.

Ricardo: Yeah, that's really cool.

Dean: Uh-huh, because you're looking at it that you're in a situation right now where you're thinking you want to do an online business, which can reach the world, but the reality is there's enough people in Scarborough that would be a good start for this. Right?

Ricardo: Right.

Dean: You want to think about how somebody can actually get the outcome. That's how I would be thinking about this. Do you have any students right now that are going through your programs, or that you're working with right now?

Ricardo: I have a couple of friends that I'm working with, and kind of helping them out. They're at different levels of their development and I'm actually using them as guinea pigs in exchange for me kind of creating my own style, my own system in a way. That's been really helpful.

Dean: That's smart. Are you documenting that on video right now?

Ricardo: I'm not documenting. I record our sessions, but I only use them for my own feedback. I don't put it out there. I take a lot of notes as to certain ways I teach something, or I'm trying to illustrate something I might later go back and be like, okay, this was really effective, because I want it to be fundamental based in that. There's a million and one techniques, but a lot of them will have a concept that if you understand the concept, you can begin to apply it and you don't necessarily need to memorize a million techniques. Once you understand the concept it makes sense. That comes from speed learning and anything else.

I'm learning every day, like okay, this applies to this, and this applies to that, and I'm trying to systemize it. Right?

Dean: Yeah.

Ricardo: Like you said, you said like a franchise situation, I'm looking at it from that perspective of how can I package this that it could actually be sold dependent of myself later.

Dean: Yes, perfect. There you go. We're on the same page then. Do you have a home base for it? Do you call it a dojo? What do you call the place?

Ricardo: Yeah, yeah, where I train out of, I train out of a couple different gyms. You can call them dojos. We call them a gym, because I do kickboxing and wrestling, so they're different places, but primarily I do have a home. It's not my personal gym. I do have my own coach that I work with, but-

Dean: Uh-huh. Would that be your goal to have a place of your own?

Ricardo: Yeah, it's a long term goal. Eventually I would like to have my own facility that encompasses everything that I'm into. It's not really a short term goal I have at the moment, but it is something I would eventually like to have, because I'm really in to the whole exercise stuff behind it, the fitness, and all that.

Dean: Sure, sure, sure. That's part of the thing, is that you've got something that you're building right now, and so it makes sense to build from the closest perimeter kind of thing. If you think about right around you, you start with, you got a couple of your buddies, you grab them. Maybe you get some that represent the different avatars that you are approaching there, and you get to use those as your laboratory, that you get to document everything that you're doing there. That's kind of an asset as you go further down the road.

What would be really great for you to have right now is a documented journey of 10 people that you helped completely transform in the last 12 months. That would be something that was valuable for you to have right now, but you don't. But you don't, so we need to start that process now, so that 12 months from now, you've got a document of what can happen in 12 months. You know?

Ricardo: Right, so almost like a case study I could use later on. Right?

Dean: Yes, that's exactly right. So you start when you think-

Ricardo: I've been thinking about that too.

Dean: Yeah, so you start to think about what would be the outcomes that you're able to create. You've got your list of the things that you mentioned, that it could start with some assessment. Do you have any kind of way to measure competency, or their knowledge, or their confidence? What would be the things that if you were to take a snapshot of quantifying the condition of your beginning subject on day one, and what those numbers, or quantifications, or qualitative improvements would be at six months, at nine months, at 12 months kind of thing?

Ricardo: I haven't put it down specifically in a system, but I do kind of use that certain things that I gauge as to where they're at, and what they need to focus on.

Dean: Perfect. That's the kind of things is looking at the road map to be able to mark improvement. If you don't know where they start, if you can't articulate and quantify the starting point, then it's difficult to point to the improvement.

Ricardo: Right.

Dean: That's what you really want, is to start laying out what your proprietary metrics are. In that, what are the metrics that you measure that when you say them, everybody is on the same play book. You know?

Ricardo: Right.

Dean: Because when you're creating a big movement like that, part of it is being able to create your own language so that insiders feel like they're on the inside of that. When you look at what CrossFit has done with the WODs, the workout of the day, that that brought that word, when you say WOD into somebody who's a cross fitter, they know what that means.

Ricardo: Yeah, that's a great example.

Dean: Yes.

Ricardo: I totally agree. It's funny you used the word road map, which is actually the same word that I used when I'm in the process of trying to systemize it all, and like you said, creating systems for everything. Like, how do you gauge where someone's at, how do you get them from A to B, and how can we turn it into an actual system that's duplicatable and can be taught, or online, or by other instructors. I'm thinking that way. Right?

Dean: Right.

Ricardo: The road map, I wanted to actually give them a specific road map from A to Z, and then complement, like you said, you gave me the idea now to complement throughout the road map, or once they reach certain pit stops, they can complement that fundamental training with perhaps an expert in whatever it is. Let's say grappling, and I could partner with them and say, "Hey, we can put this course together so it's a little bit more experienced, more advanced, but if you really want to go deep on this, I partnered with so and so, and this course is available separate. It's kind of outside of the road map. It's not required, but if you really want to go deep in it, really go deep." That idea sounds really cool as well.

Dean: Yeah, that's the whole point. If you think about building it as a membership site type of thing, that that would be the kinds of things that you can add, and build into it, or they could be things that you could sell separately.

Ricardo: Yeah, yeah. The main idea was, I was thinking a membership site. I like the continuity thing. What I found was in the past when trying to do joint ventures, the issue with the membership site I ran into was, that the instructors felt like if they're paying a membership fee, how are they supposed to differentiate when they got into your membership through their course, or through the other instructor's course. That's where I came up after doing and research and stuff, it would make sense to have my own road map, and then complement and venture outside of it, so there's no conflict. Maybe I'm missing something, but that's kind of the only solution I thought made sense. Right?

Dean: Yeah, you want to control the frame. You're creating the playing field, this is the context for it. Like, so in our world, the eight profit activators, and the before, during, after are the context of everything that I do. Then the individual profit activators all have so much depth underneath them, so everything fits into one of those eight containers. I think that would be a good thing if you've got your road map there. On the real estate side, I have the framework, or the context is the listing agent lifestyle. We've got eight elements of the listing agent lifestyle that make up the framework.

We talk about the five business elements of getting listings, multiplying their listings, getting referrals, converting leads, finding buyers. Then we've got the three lifestyle elements of abundant time, and daily joy, and financial peace, that those, all of everything that we're talking about, fits in those eight buckets, the eight frameworks there. We've got our own metrics to measure each of those, including starting with the score card where people can see where they are in relation to those. You know?

Ricardo: Right, okay. Makes sense.

Dean: Yeah. I think that's really what you're looking for, is you're at the very early stages of creating what could be a big thing, but you're just looking at, you've got to set the context right first, and then fill it out as you go.

Ricardo: Okay. Comparing to that, specifically with the road map in itself, does it make sense? Like you said, it makes sense to map it out, I guess, in advance?

Dean: Yes, of course.

Ricardo: And obviously document each step along the way, and how you gauge where people are at.

Dean: Yeah, because you've got to have a hypothesis. You've got to have a, this is where we're heading, this is where I think I can take you kind of thing. That goes a long way, just having that you've got the map, that it's a journey that somebody wants to take. It really starts with the two end points. Here's where you are right now, and here's where we want to go. This is the promised land, or where we're headed, and in order to get to the promised land, we've got to pass through all of these areas here. If I'm saying to people that in the promised land, as far as getting listings, you've got a system that people who want to sell their house will call you, and that you don't have to make any outbound phone calls, and they call you to come and list their house. That's the promised land.

Now in order to get there, we've got to choose the area where you want to get listings. We've got to mail them post cards that get them to raise their hand, and then we've got to have a newsletter and a follow up to mail to them every month, until they're ready to list their house. You start to document that. It's funny now, I just realized that you're in Scarborough, well I've got a five year case study that I did with Tony Kalsi in Scarborough. He's in our GoGo Agent world. He's the guy I've been documenting the getting listings program with him.

Ricardo: That's hilarious. Small world.

Dean: It is funny. If you live in that Scarborough area, you probably get his postcards or something.

Ricardo: Well, here's the thing. I actually originally heard about you through the real estate agent at one point.

Dean: Oh, that's so funny.

Ricardo: Yeah, the real estate agent. I came across your stuff and your stuff inspired me to get into more of the route of info marketing, and Joe Polish, and all that cool stuff.

Dean: Gotcha, gotcha.

Ricardo: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've been a fan of yours for a very long time now.

Dean: Oh, that's awesome.

Ricardo: That's really cool. Can I just tell you one thing I'm working on to give you a kind of just where I'm at on this whole thing.

Dean: Yeah.

Ricardo: Okay. Within the combat itself there's like three main ranges of combat, one of them striking range, which means you can hit your opponent and he can hit you, using your long range weapons, your punches and your kicks. As I broke down, okay, what are the fundamental areas that one would need to focus on. There's certain key areas. I narrowed it down to footwork being the first thing and the most important when it comes to striking. I created a lead magnet, which is just a mini course, very straightforward but it's the beginning of how to develop your stance, and I have a blog post that I'm putting together to go with it. I've already started to lay down the foundation of that road map.

Dean: Awesome.

Ricardo: That will be targeting people who are just getting started, like what would be the first thing, what would be your stance, and understanding footwork and how it plays out in a fight or in any situation.

Dean: Sorry. Are you there?

Ricardo: I'm there, I'm here.

Dean: Okay sorry, I pushed the button by accident. Right.

Ricardo: Anyways, that's one of the lead magnets I'm rolling out.

Dean: Has it worked yet so far?

Ricardo: I'm literally just going to be launching that specific lead magnet in the next two weeks, it'll be completed.

Dean: Gotcha.

Ricardo: I'm going to be driving traffic to the blog post, which will then target and drive them to that lead magnet. Then I have like a little quiz, kind of figuring out what their frustrations within that area, and then based that, I'm going to create some kind of an offer, like a little ticket front end offer. At this point I'm just validating the idea. Right?

Dean: Mm-hmm.

Ricardo: I'm not sure. I just wanted to get your feedback, what you thought, if that process makes sense.

Dean: Yeah. That's on the right thing, if that's one of the elements. If you're going to be the total package, you've got to master striking distance, or whatever those things are, that's certainly one of the elements. That's just like with the listing agent lifestyle, you've got to master getting listings, and you've got to master getting referrals, and converting leads. Definitely, those are the big bucket container things.

Ricardo: Exactly, yeah.

Dean: Yeah. Once you get those right, those are like the boundaries of the stuff. You know?

Ricardo: Exactly, exactly. You can go really deep into it, and then there's guys that are at the top of the pyramid as far as striking, which that's much later though. Whereas originally I was thinking of doing that from the beginning. Once I started to think, as far as systemizing, it didn't make sense. We could start with that, because you're kind of jumping to that right away. Right?

Dean: Yeah, yeah. That's all-

Ricardo: Yeah.

Dean: That's all good then. Getting all of that kind of outlined would be a great first step here, because that's going to form the foundation of everything. Then you can see that within that striking distance, there's how many different layers of that are there. There's all of the everything it happens, strikes all happen in there, but then there's take downs I imagine would be another one. Right? Excuse me. All the grappling things, and yeah. I think when you look at what are the big contexts of it, that's going to shape everything, and then people can zoom into that channel, and really go down. Then they can assess themselves as a master of that, or as something that needs some work, and monitor improvement.

Ricardo: Yeah, yeah, exactly. That's where I'm just trying to take something that's very complex and complicated and make it simple, and make it easy to understand, because a lot of people, they'll jump from one thing to the other. In this particular niche, I understand it, I live it, and I know exactly what that frustration is like. To be able to document it in a way to make it as simple as possible is what I am currently doing.

Dean: Yes, perfect. I like what I'm hearing.

Ricardo: There's a lot of different components, but I've narrowed it to three main areas. It's much easier to think about three areas versus 51, or whatever. Right?

Dean: Yeah, right. Mm-hmm. That's kind of like our before unit, during unit, and after unit. Three is easy to understand, but then when you want to go a little more granular, there's some subdivision underneath each of those three to get us to our eight profit activators then, because there's four profit activators that make up the before unit, and two for the during unit, and two for the after unit.

Ricardo: Exactly. I'm actually using the principles of how you lay those things out. I'm actually applying it to my niche, because it's very helpful to understand something when you narrow it that way. It's been very helpful for me and it's serving as inspiration to use it in my own niche, with my own language. I think I'm on the right track. I just don't know. For me, the difficulty has been I don't know how to perhaps articulate it or to know if I'm on the right path, if that's what people actually really even want.

Dean: Yeah, yeah. There's the thing. It doesn't matter necessarily what they want or if they need. When I look at it, that in the marketing side of things that we're doing with the entrepreneurs, since there's all kinds of different businesses, what I'm teaching are the eight profit activators, which is the framework for all of it. That universally applies to all businesses, but when I talk to the real estate agents, I don't need to teach them the eight profit activators, because I've already applied the eight profit activators to the real estate business, so I've already got the solutions for them.

The difference is it's like one is music theory, like I'm teaching people how the structure of songs in the eight profit activators, and what I'm doing on the real estate side is I'm providing sheet music for songs that I've already written. If you want to sing a song called How Do I Get Listings, I've applied the eight profit activators to that. Let's select a single target market, lake front home owners. Let's use profit activator two to get them to raise their hand. Let's send a postcard offering the April, 2019, report on Winter Haven lake front house prices.

Profit activator three, let's educate and motivate them, so we send the newsletter. We have a get top dollar newsletter that we send every month along with a cover letter, and some information on what's happened in the last 30 days. Profit activator four, let's make an offer that makes it easy for people to take the next step, so we use, whenever you're ready here's how we can help you. We've got a pinpoint price analysis, a room by room review, or our silent market. All of those things, that song was written using the construct of the eight profit activators, but they don't need to know the eight profit activators, or I don't even explain the eight profit activators to them to do it, because I've already written the song. All you need to know is how to play this song.

Ricardo: Right, okay.

Dean: The same thing, it's more important for you to know where it all fits, and that you keep people on track. You know?

Ricardo: Yes. Okay.

Dean: It's your organizing blueprint for how it all fits together.

Ricardo: Okay, yeah, that makes sense. Actually that brings up a question. When selecting a target market, do you recommend selecting a target market and then kind of articulating that before and after, that whole journey or transformation after you select the target, or do you recommend starting with what they journey looked like, and then saying, "Who is the ideal person or target?"

Dean: Yeah, that's exactly it. I want to start with you is. First of all, in order to create a dream come true in profit activator five, we want to start with what would be a dream come true for you. What do you want the dream to be, and then what do you know how to do, what do you know how to create, what's the best result that you could create for somebody, and then who is the person that would fit into that world. If you're saying it was kind of visual and intriguing when you were initially talking about taking someone who's from helpless from wimp to fighter, that that creates a very visual thing.

When you imagine if that's your thing, that's the person that you want to be able to attract. There's a lot of track record of people in that world. I think about Vince Del Monte in Canada there, he's a pro fitness model but he helps people add muscle, and his heart was for helping skinny guys build size, because he was teased as Skinny Vinnie when he was growing up. That was his whole thing, is that he learned how to pack on muscle and now he's this super fit fitness model. He's coming from that back story of I was teased and skinny, and I embarrassed and I learned how to pack on this muscle fast. That is an appealing thing to people who want to do the same thing that Vinnie did.

If you take that same thing, that there's an avatar for, when you say a wimp, that what does that person look like. Who personifies that? If you can take somebody that looks just like, or feels, or sounds, or appears just like me, if I'm your ideal, and you're documenting this transformation over the six months to a year with somebody, that's going to be inspiring because if they did it, I watched it happen, and I want to get that result.

Ricardo: Okay. I'm happy to hear that. That's how I did it. I clearly defined what I want it to look like and what I can contribute, and that's why I was more leaning to more so the beginner, because I feel like I've already done that for people. I just didn't document it or systemize it, but I have seen it in action. Even in myself on my own, I've actually walked that journey, going from helpless to confident in that I can defend myself in most situations. Yeah.

Dean: There's the thing, is that first of all the three steps there, is that the 3D model here, is that you gotta be able to do it, which is one thing. Then you gotta document it so that you know what you did, and then you gotta be able to duplicate it.

Ricardo: Yes.

Dean: When you get to that model, if you can do it and you've documented it, and you can duplicate it, now you're ready to scale.

Ricardo: That's cool. Yeah. Another little bit of a challenge is, and perhaps it's a challenge I've made up in my own mind, but it is a realistic challenge is that, everywhere you go there are gyms and that's a great thing. That means that there's money in the niche, but the challenge of it is when you go to a gym, they do their own thing. Right?

Dean: Yes, right.

Ricardo: When you go there, you can't say, "Hey, I'm watching this guy online. I'm just going to do this." They're going to say, "Get out. We're doing it my way." Right?

Dean: Yes.

Ricardo: That's where I'm wondering where we could fit in.

Dean: Well, let me ask you this, with the things you do, do you need a gym to do it? I think about-

Ricardo: No.

Dean: It's an interesting thing. Maybe thinking outside of the box there, what do you really need? What kind of an environment do you really need?

Ricardo: You're absolutely right. You don't specifically need a gym, but what you do need? Okay, there's a lot of this stuff. When working footwork drills, if you're just starting out you just kind of need any space, but when we're talking about actually being effective, you do need 100% need a training partner, because if you don't have experience with somebody trying to actually hit you, you're not going to get better. This is the reality. You need some kind of space and you do need mats. Definitely for take downs and grappling you need mats.

Dean: Right, of course.

Ricardo: You don't specifically need to join an MMA gym, but you do need at least like 150 square foot of space, and you need mats, and you need a training partner. Those are the three things you must have.

Dean: Right. Is there a way to think about creating a pop up space like that somewhere?

Ricardo: I had thought about that. I don't know if you know the Gracie? If you-

Dean: I was going to use the Gracies as an example, because Eben Pagan and I went to the Gracie dojo in LA years ago.

Ricardo: Awesome.

Dean:  Yeah, yeah. That's an interesting thing. There's an example. We were there 20 years ago. This was back when MMA was cage fighting really. It was just starting to be a gentleman's sport kind of thing. Right?

Ricardo: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: The Gracies were the dominant empire of that. They were the legacy. They had this dojo in LA that was the mecca. That's the place kind of thing. That's where. I think we're at a situation now where you could almost create that same kind of vibe around something, that you can create the home of this method of what you're talking about. When you go there they play this video on a loop of all of these other practitioners coming to their place, trying to take on Hixon. I think Hixon or I forget what their names were, but whoever the main guy was, and time after time this Kung Fu master comes to do it and Gracie sweeps the leg, takes him down, and it's over.

It's just like documenting again and again, and again on a loop all of these world champions that he's taking down and winning. That's the kind of movement that you can create. You know?

Ricardo: Yeah. It started with the Gracie headquarters, which is where you're talking about in LA there. They actually started GracieUniversity.com. What's cool is they did exactly this, it's like from raw beginners to a black belt. They systemized everything into chapters and very well organized. I'm a member and I learned a lot from them too, because I actually believe in online training. It's just you do need a good partner and you need a place. What they started was it's called Gracie Garage. What it is, is you can actually set up garages and they can certify you kind of thing, and you can play their videos and learn.

I've actually gone to a Gracie Garage in Oshawa where I went in there skeptical. I was like, let's see what these guys are up to, because I had my wrestling coaches and all that. When I went there, I was impressed, man, because these guys had no background. They weren't part of a gym. They were just doing what they were learning, and I was very impressed at how good they were, and how structurally sound. That's where it sparked that idea in me, like wow, you know what? I could do this in my own thing.

Dean: Yes, and that's the kind of thing when you look at it. I think about Fit Body Bootcamp, those guys, like Bedros Keuilian, they've built a huge thing. That started out people doing boot camps in a park, or in a school gym, or wherever.

Ricardo: Right. Yeah, I could see how that could work and it would be cool, because then they have this network thing on their website where now they're huge. You can literally put in your city, and you can put in someone who's looking for a training partner, you can put your weight, class, your belt rank, whatever, and it'll pop up like 10 guys in my area. I've actually reached out and said, "Hey, do you want to train?" It's really cool. I've met a couple people like that and I would do the same for my MMA thing.

That's something that takes time, that's down the line. My thing is how do you get from where you don't have that to convincing people.

Dean: You start it in Scarborough.

Ricardo: Okay.

Dean: You start it there. You start with the epicenter. Most of the time people, in the old world, to go and spread a message you had to go far and wide, and bring the message out to people. Right?

Ricardo: Yeah.

Dean: Now you could stay right there in Scarborough and bring the whole world to Scarborough. You could be this beacon, because you could live stream, you can everything. It becomes the world headquarters for it.

Ricardo: You're saying to perhaps set up my own little spot?

Dean: Yeah, I'm saying that whatever this is going to be, you want to set up the prototype for it, that you're subject one. You're the prototype of this. Just like McDonald's started with one hamburger restaurant in California.

Ricardo: Right, okay. Yeah. I get it. Like a buddy's basement to show, hey, if you know someone with a basement, you guys can get started.

Dean: Yes, that's exactly right. A fight club, that's almost what it comes down to.

Ricardo: Yeah, yeah. That's pretty cool.

Dean: Yeah. That's the thing, I mean I don't know whether that's not the right vibe of what you're talking about, but that's kind of a thing that has an underground kind of appeal to it or whatever.

Ricardo: No, it's exactly in line with my vision for what I have for it. Right?

Dean: Yeah, right.

Ricardo: I've had a little struggle with how to articulate it, or how to kind of set it in motion. Right?

Dean: Yes.

Ricardo: Definitely it falls in line with exactly what I've seen in my own mind, and what I've written down, and everything we've talked about makes sense. It's kind of where I want to head from here.

Dean: We just need to nail your thinking down to the three steps that I talk about, those three D's, do it, document it, duplicate it. I think that you've got to have the discipline to limit, put your blinders on, narrow your focus to just immediately around you, and take the buddies that you're working with right now, the ones that you've been using as your laboratory, to kind of prove that you can do it is that first level of it. Then the next level of it is to, can you duplicate it with 10 people, no more, just 10 people.

As you're doing that, you're documenting it. That's really the level there. As you're documenting it, you're using those 10 as the way to document everything and seeing what your success rate it, and seeing what the outcome is, and documenting all of those results. Then duplicating it would be going out now to 100 people within the boundaries of Scarborough. That's really the thing is just narrow your focus there.

Ricardo: Okay.

Dean: Then when you've got that, now you show people, here's how you do it.

Ricardo: Right, because now it's an actual system that's duplicatable.

Dean: Yep.

Ricardo: Okay. Now to get from like you say, the three D's, which is cool, to go from from A to Zed in that for myself, that will take time. In the meantime, what makes sense to do? I guess continue to build my subscriber base, and audience, and .because that's also part of it too, right? Of the-

Dean: Yeah, but I think part of it is let's see, if you just constrain your lead generation and stuff to the East side of Toronto there on a radius of within your area, that helps you feed everything. You know?

Ricardo: Oh, okay.

Dean: All of this, you don't want to go out too soon. You want to go out with the model in place. You know?

Ricardo: Oh, okay, I see.

Dean: It doesn't matter. You're not gaining anything by attracting people from Poughkeepsie right now, because it's not what this is about yet. You know?

Ricardo: Right. Okay. Even my lead generation effort should be tailored to the specific area?

Dean: Yeah, because you want to start building an incubator that when it comes time, that you want to find your first 10 people that you want to work with, you want to find them right there in Scarborough. Then you want to expand out so that you're going to multiply to 100, so maybe you want to get 1000 subscribers in East Toronto. You know?

Ricardo: Right.

Dean: That's the thing. My girlfriend has a studio here in Winter Haven called Amazing Brows and Lashes, and we've been focused on list building, and she's generated a list of 2500 ladies between 30 and 55 in Winter Haven, that are all interested in eyebrows and lashes. She's got this annuity now that every time she sends a weekly email out to everybody and every time she sends emails, people book stuff with her.

Ricardo: Yeah, that's really cool.

Dean: Right. I think that's where you want to start. You want to start, like what would it look like, what are you trying to duplicate if you're going to offer this to someone else to do what you've done in Mississauga. That's how you want to think about this.

Ricardo: Okay. It's almost like, I'm looking at it as if I'm building the prototype that I can then later repackage and sell-

Dean: Yep.

Ricardo: in a sense, whether it's online and even in physical locations to say, "Hey, you guys can take this system and like a franchise kind of thing."

Dean: Right, that's exactly right. Yes.

Ricardo: You have to build that first prototype using the three D's.

Dean: Yeah, yep. You have to show them what that is. Then it's the same thing. Now you've got level two of the three D's, that now the level two of the three D's is you've built Scarborough into a mature thing, you've done that. You've done it, you've got to a point where it's a mature thing, you went through the three D's there. Now you've got to document what you do to do it again. You need to prove that you can now do what you did in Scarborough, you need to be able to do that in Mississauga, or in Ottawa, or wherever, pick another area.

Ricardo: Yes, exactly.

Dean: You gotta document all the things that somebody does in following your documented plan. You gotta see that, does the way I documented this, is this easy for someone else to duplicate.

Ricardo: Right, right, because when I'm not there, it's going to be obviously slightly different.

Dean: Yeah.

Ricardo: Uh-huh, okay.

Dean: You watch that and observe it, and you're going to learn from that, and then once you've successfully duplicated what you did in Scarborough, in Mississauga, now you've got, let's go with 10, of those and try it in 10 other places. Then you're good to go. You know?

Ricardo: Right. Okay. Sounds really interesting.

Dean: It's pretty exciting. The thing is, when you get down to those manageable scales, it keeps you focused on the activity. What's distracting or discouraging is when you're trying to go too fast, when you're trying to get people excited about doing one in Mississauga, or Ottawa, and you haven't done it yet in Scarborough. Keeping yourself focused on those things and moving as fast as you can to document and duplicate what you've done.

Ricardo: Right, okay.

Dean: The good news is once you do that, it's a solid foundation and you've got a long runway, assuming you've picked the right horse. If you picked the right horse, if MMA is going to last longer than say I don't know, macarena dancing or something, that you've got something that's going to be here 20 years from now. MMA has been here for a long time and it's still going to be here 20 years from now.

Ricardo: Yeah. It's like a child and now a major deal they've got with ESPN, it's going to be a nationwide thing. It's only growing, you know? It's huge now, but it's only growing. That's why it's a great time for sure. Now just one last question with respect to that, while doing that, how would you like If it was you and you were doing this, lend out, how would you make money along the way?

Dean: Well, you'd be making money. You'd be charging people. You'd be making money the same way. You're going to be doing it, that's at the highest level, whatever people are. For getting the one on one help. You're thinking about the lower priced things as an outcropping, later of the being able to do it, because you're getting paid while you're creating the program essentially.

Ricardo: Right. Okay. Almost like coaching.

Dean: Yes, that's exactly right.

Ricardo: Okay. Gotcha.

Dean: I like it. It's very exciting. It's a great model. It's one of my favorite models too.

Ricardo: Yeah, it's really interesting how it works. Inspired by the book, the E-Myth with the whole systemizing everything.

Dean: Yes, that's the book that changed my life. That's for sure.

Ricardo: Yeah. Till reading that, never really thought of it, like the franchise prototype. Now that I have I approach everything with that mentality, can I turn this into a prototype, can it be duplicatable in my scale. Even if I don't want to, I still want to create it that way because it just makes sense. Right?

Dean: That's exactly right, because then it's saleable. You can sell it to somebody else or you could replace yourself in it.

Ricardo: Right, exactly. Interesting. That's pretty cool. I never really thought of it that way with this particular thing.

Dean: Awesome. Well, I can't wait to see how it all unfolds.

Ricardo: Yeah, I can't wait to tell you.

Dean: Okay, well do something about that temperature for me, so it'll be warm and ready for me when I get up there in June.

Ricardo: If I can change the temperature, I'm starting a new business.

Dean: Okay, perfect. Yeah, yeah. Awesome. Thanks, Ricardo.

Ricardo: Thank you, Dean. I really appreciate it.

Dean: Okay, have a great day.

Ricardo: You as well, thanks.

Dean: Bye. There we have it, another great episode. Thanks for listening in. If you want to continue the conversation or go deeper in how the eight profit activators can apply to your business, two things you can do. Right now you can go to MoreCheeseLessWhiskers.com and you can download a copy of the More Cheese, Less Whiskers book, and you can listen to the back episodes of course, if you're just listening here on iTunes. Secondly, the thing that we talk about in applying all of the eight profit activators are part of the Breakthrough DNA process. You can download a book and a score card, and watch a video all about the eight profit activators at BreakThroughDNA.com.

That's a great place to start the journey in applying this scientific approach to growing your business. That's really the way we think about Breakthrough DNA as an operating system that you can overlay on your existing business, and immediately look for insights there. That's it for this week. Have a great week and we will be back next time with another episode of More Cheese, Less Whiskers.